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Sunhead
Sunhead
Strife: GL

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Joined: 24 Oct 2008
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re: Fallout

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The outcome of the meeting was that the people involved in the use of the Ret Pally exploit were asked to leave.

Their actions brought the guild into disrepute and disciplinary action was required. Trouble and Strife were the only Horde guild on Khaz to get a new Heroic Kill on that day.

This means that the Progression team, known currently as Bodyslamming Burgers will sadly be leaving Trouble and Strife.

It pains me to see people who have been with the guild through Wrath and Cata leave this way, but such behavior is a clear violation of our operating principals.

They are forming a new guild and I personally wish them well in their endeavor.
Madzs
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Joined: 25 Aug 2010
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Sorry to hear about this mess, it was lot of fun raiding with Dooms/Fohn grp through Flands, at the core they are good guys.

I think jealous/envy got the better part of this guild and it’s a shame because even though they exploited the pally bug, people should not forget they also brought a lot of credos to TnS from previous progression.

I think what fell over was the lack of humility from the progression grp when they did get so far ahead of progression from the casual grp/rest of guild.

It is only human nature to covet others what you don’t have yourself at times.

I do too wish them well and hope TnS leadership grp also gives Doom and his guild a helping hand with mats/gold as they have contributed a heck of a lot to the wealth of this guild.
AsraiRogue
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Joined: 05 May 2009
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We will be, the funds and mats were meant to be discussed on thursday.

There were alot of issues i dont care to get into and there are sides to every story. But we shall leave it at that. Im sad to see them go.


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Rayjaxx
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Joined: 10 May 2010
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Sad to see the break up and I know exactly what you mean Mads, i made similar observations.
Effectively Blizzards error has broken up the guild which is the sad part (but i could see the tension prior to this)
They didn’t get a realm 1st effectively only 1 extra boss and any loot is pretty much moot, but as Sun said any exploits are against T&S operating principals. Tough Call.

We had the best of times and the worst of times, was happy to raid have raided with you.
Good Luck to you all.


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Livella
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Joined: 18 Mar 2010
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re: Fallout

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I agree, it is always sad to see people leave the guild, especially long time members. While it’s obviously pretty fresh and emotional right now, I think we also need to focus on the positives that can come out of it for both sides.

Leaving aside exploits and all that, I think we had a growing issue in the guild of incompatible goals. For myself, I joined the guild because its stated aim was to be a friendly, mature, casual raiding guild. Having just come back from a 6 month break, the change in the atmosphere of the guild was quite noticeable to me and I felt like it was really steering away from this aim.

Different people have different goals in the game. For some people the main goal is to have fun with friends while raiding, for others it is hardcore progression. There is nothing wrong with either of these goals, they are both totally valid. But unfortunately they very rarely go together in the one guild - the needs of each group are just too different. For instance, the casuals want to recruit based partly on social/friendly criteria, the hardcores want to recruit based on gear/raid experience criteria. The casuals then get resentful if people are brought into the guild that aren’t very social/friendly, the hardcores get resentful if they have to take people who aren’t geared and experienced enough. That is just one example, but the same sort of conflict crops up in all the different areas of the running of the guild.

Also, I have been playing since Vanilla and I have been in quite a few guilds in that time. Not once have I seen a guild work that was trying to be all things to all people. When a guild tries to do that one of three things happens. a) the casuals leave because the guild isn’t friendly and social enough for them anymore, b) the hardcores leave because they feel the guild is holding them back c) the guild disbands.

I honestly think this solution will end up being best for all involved. For the Prog group, they can build their new guild with progression goals in mind from day 1. They can recruit based on this, they can set up their guild structure and rules to support that goal. For T&S, we can take this opportunity to refocus on the original premise of the guild, which (correct me here founders if I have it wrong!) is to be a friendly, social, mature, casual raiding guild.

Please understand that this is in no way intended as a criticism of the Prog group. I am not blaming them for wanting hardcore progression at all, I think they should be free to pursue that goal and that this is the best way for them to do that. I wish them all the best and I am fully expecting that they will go on to do awesome things.

PS. Sorry for the essay. I have been very quiet throughout all of this, guess it is coming out now!
AvaneaP

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Joined: 26 Dec 2010
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Well...this isn't what I was expecting when I logged on to the forums...


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